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Topic Title: Pulling your own fuse out .......
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Created On: 11 October 2018 03:09 PM
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 11 October 2018 03:09 PM
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dustydazzler

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 11 October 2018 03:14 PM
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geoffsd

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Doesn't the meter cut them off when the money runs out?
 11 October 2018 03:30 PM
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AncientMariner

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Unless it's a smart meter set as a pre-payment meter, how does the supplier know?

Something does not sound right.

Clive

-------------------------
Clive S Carver GCGI IEng MIET MITP
 11 October 2018 03:36 PM
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broadgage

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Does it actually state that significant numbers of consumers are removing the suppliers cut-out fuse?
By "self disconnecting" I think they mean running out of credit rather than pulling the fuse.
 11 October 2018 03:36 PM
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Fm

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Sounds like poor reporting

Maybe turning off main switch to ensure no energy used but pulling main fuse- I doubt it
 11 October 2018 04:05 PM
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mapj1

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I read it as 'deliberately letting the meter run out of credit' which I can well believe.

normallly they allow a bit of 'overdraft'. Typical T and C from a well known supplier.

Don't worry, your prepayment meter has £6 of emergency credit. Many customers find that this is enough to cover three days at normal energy use. This should give you time to top up your key or card. You'll need to have the key or card in the meter to access the emergency credit.

You'll need to pay back the emergency credit next time you top up, and any remainder will be added as credit. If you use all your emergency credit your electricity or gas will switch off.


Of course, even if you turn off, the standing charge keeps counting on the meter, and will drive it into debt anyway..

looks like about 10% of us have such a meter, so just 70,000 running out of cash at some point in the year is not that surprising.

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regards Mike
 11 October 2018 05:29 PM
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alancapon

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The news article is correct, the topic title here is wrong. Self Disconnection is the phrase used when consumers do not put money in their key meter, with the intention of deliberately running out of credit.

Regards,

Alan.
 11 October 2018 05:36 PM
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geoffsd

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How is it known that they do it intentionally?
 11 October 2018 06:25 PM
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alancapon

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If it wasn't intentional, they would not let it run out. Most systems allow for "emergency credit" which usually allows sufficient to reach the next morning. The key meters are sort of smart, as they use the keys to transfer data. They take money to the meter, and collect and return the meter reading, whether the credit had run out, whether the incoming supply had failed plus a few other things which are sent to the supplier when you "charge" the key.

Regards,

Alan.
 11 October 2018 06:28 PM
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alancapon

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Originally posted by: AncientMariner
Unless it's a smart meter set as a pre-payment meter, how does the supplier know?

The information is collected by the key from the meter and sent to the supplier the next time the key is charged.

Regards,

Alan.
 11 October 2018 06:33 PM
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IronFreely

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A prepayment meter will take you into a £6 debt eventually even if your main switch is off because it deletes credit as a service charge, not if you pull the main fuse though because it's based on time and it can't count when it's off.
 11 October 2018 06:42 PM
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geoffsd

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I know how they work, but I wouldn't class it as intentional - in that it is done for a purpose.

In my dealings with tenants, some consider the credit as "it hasn't run out yet", then before they put money on the key, it runs out.

That's just life for them, juggling all their payments, when they can't afford to buy more electric until they have to.
 11 October 2018 07:08 PM
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IronFreely

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That's an interesting point of view Geoff, I think it's still intentional, but justified.... I've had to put in my T's and C's that it's the landlords responsibility to ensure there's enough credit to carry out live tests. I all too often visit properties where I just know the landlords are creaming it in straight off the tax payer and just don't give a monkeys, I once gave a quote to install smoke detectors in an HMO and 18 months later the landlord rang me up and asked if I'd still do it, 18 months with no smoke detectors! I'm also surprised by the number of landlords who think that when I do an EICR that they're paying me to give them a certificate that lets them carry on renting regardless, that's why round here you get your money before emailing the report or you might find they won't pay because they don't like hearing that live parts shouldn't be exsposed... "But I asked you to give me a Landlords Certificate" they say, "I wasn't paying you to say it's not suitable for continued use"!
Then again plenty of landlords are really responsible.
 11 October 2018 07:38 PM
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geoffsd

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I'm not entirely sure what you mean by "creaming it in straight off the tax payer and just don't give a monkeys" in this regard.
Obviously there are some like that but I don't know what that has to do with pre-payment meters.

I don't think the landlord has anything to do with the cost of electricity.
 11 October 2018 07:46 PM
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sparkingchip

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A lot of shops will now only accept cash for meter top ups, as I found out when I went to top one up to do void maintenance in a flat .

Since contactless payments became available on debit and credit cards it has become very easy to get a thirty quid credit on a meter, which then gets reported as fraud resulting in the payment being reversed.

And no customers are not pulling their own fuses instead of using the main switch.
 11 October 2018 07:46 PM
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alancapon

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Originally posted by: geoffsd
I know how they work, but I wouldn't class it as intentional - in that it is done for a purpose. . .

You usually have to make a deliberate action to start the emergency credit, therefore the fact that more money is needed on the key is known about. Incidentally, our costs are exactly the same whether you have a credit or pre-payment (key) meter.

Regards,

Alan.
 11 October 2018 08:03 PM
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IronFreely

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our costs are exactly the same whether you have a credit or pre-payment (key) meter.


Are they? I thought it was well known that prepayment tariffs are the most exspensive, not only do they cost more per unit but you have no freedom to shop around for the best tarriffs with a different supplier.
https://www.theenergyshop.com/advice-guides-prepaymentMeter#.W7-eFhrTWhA
 11 October 2018 08:28 PM
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geoffsd

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Maybe intentional is just the wrong word - perhaps they don't mind running out.

It's obviously their fault but like running out of petrol - not done intentionally.
 11 October 2018 09:59 PM
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chrispearson

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Originally posted by: alancapon

If it wasn't intentional, they would not let it run out.


Hm! At one time I had a flat provided by my employer whilst I was working away from home. It had a key meter. With a bit of common sense, it was possible to allow for annual leave periods, but sick leave was another matter. Returning to a cold flat was one thing, the stench of thawed fish fingers was quite another.
 12 October 2018 12:38 AM
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alancapon

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Originally posted by: IronFreely
. . . I thought it was well known that prepayment tariffs are the most exspensive, not only do they cost more per unit but you have no freedom to shop around for the best tarriffs with a different supplier. . .

It is a bit different here on the Isle of Man. We are still nationalised and are the sole supplier. Our standing charge and unit rate are identical for credit or pre-payment. In fact you can get "comfyheat" which is our version of Economy 7 on a pre-payment meter, without paying more than for the same tariff on a credit meter.

Regards,

Alan.
IET » Wiring and the regulations » Pulling your own fuse out .......

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