IET
Decrease font size
Increase font size
Topic Title: When do you stop being a 'graduate'
Topic Summary:
Created On: 02 August 2011 03:53 PM
Status: Read Only
Linear : Threading : Single : Branch
Search Topic Search Topic
Topic Tools Topic Tools
View similar topics View similar topics
View topic in raw text format. Print this topic.
 02 August 2011 03:53 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message



apackwood

Posts: 16
Joined: 12 November 2010

So, 9 months or so after I started work at my first job in electronic design I get to wondering, at what point do young engineers stop being considered as the 'graduate'.

Understand I'm not unhappy with being labelled as a graduate, the company I'm with are offereing excellant support and have allways got people to help me out when I'm stuck (which is often).

Graduate scheme's I assume transition you at the end of them into a full proffesional, but as the only raw graduate in the company there is no 'this is what you have to do to become an engineer', I work on similar jobs to all the other engineers, admittedly simpler ones at the moment.

So the question I suppose is, how long does the transition from graduate to engineer take? Is it something you push through yourself, or is it something achieved via recognition from above?

-------------------------
Andrew Packwood MEng
 03 August 2011 09:26 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message


Avatar for icoggan.
icoggan

Posts: 27
Joined: 26 November 2002

You will be a Graduate Engineer up until the point you become a Young Engineer! Depending on which sector you work in there can often be a large demographic gap within the age range, so likely as a recent grad you may far younger than most. It's got nothing to do with knowledge / output. People may mistake you for a Graduate for anything upto the first 10 years of your career (more if you look young). You do have a opportunity to influence this by not using the term to introduce yourself when you do round the table introductions and also by displaying behaviour people might associate with someone with more experience. I would say people are far more generous with their time and more eager to share their knowledge if they assume you are a recent grad, so there are certainly benefits.
 01 September 2011 11:12 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message


Avatar for noumanabid.
noumanabid

Posts: 14
Joined: 11 October 2007

Hi

When you get your Bachelor Degree in Engineering or Technology then you have to apply at a professional Institution or Council for Graduate Membership or equivalent. It is your first step. Then that institution or council will guide or mentor you for your further professional career growth and you start your professional life at relevant market i.e. industry etc at a bachelor level position. After gaining at least 3 to 5 years Graduate Level experience, you may get the opportunity to apply for full membership or equivalent and get the professional titles after evaluation and essesment. That is the point where your grad. level is converted to the Engineer level actually.

Cheers

-------------------------
Nouman Abid Chuhan
HND Engg (UK) B.Tech Hons (Pak) MIET (UK)
+923334451158
 19 September 2011 05:57 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message



SchwenLarson

Posts: 1
Joined: 19 September 2011

In any case, you want to put your best foot forward at all times and make yourself "indispensable" so that you become the valued engineer.
 19 September 2011 04:54 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message



kasese

Posts: 183
Joined: 31 March 2006

Generally when you are older than your boss
Tim
 19 September 2011 05:20 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message



amillar

Posts: 1918
Joined: 28 May 2002

Originally posted by: noumanabid
When you get your Bachelor Degree in Engineering or Technology then you have to apply at a professional Institution or Council for Graduate Membership or equivalent. It is your first step. Then that institution or council will guide or mentor you for your further professional career growth and you start your professional life at relevant market i.e. industry etc at a bachelor level position. After gaining at least 3 to 5 years Graduate Level experience, you may get the opportunity to apply for full membership or equivalent and get the professional titles after evaluation and essesment. That is the point where your grad. level is converted to the Engineer level actually.


True as far as Institute recognition is concerned, but within individual companies they can give you any job title they want whenever they want - there is no regulation of titles in engineering.

So, if your title is currently "graduate engineer" someone invented that title for a reason - maybe to pacify the finance director by showing the recruitment was cheap, maybe to pacify the HR director by showing that the company was commited to developing talent. What typically happens now is that you stay at that grade until there is a reason to change it. It may be that your company has a policy on a time period for this; but more commonly the change happens either because there is a reorganisation (so effectively you have a change of role), or they realise they have to give you more money or lose you.

Best thing to do is to ask your manager: asking what you need to do to progress shows commitment and is a perfectly reasonable thing to do. If your company has a performance management programme (e.g. annual appraisals) you should make sure that there is something recorded there about how you achieve Engineer title - again making it clear that this is to increase your value to the company, not "because I'm worth it"!

-------------------------
Andy Millar CEng MIET CMgr MCMI

http://www.linkedin.com/in/millarandy

"The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress." Joseph Joubert
 22 September 2011 04:10 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message



alamatec

Posts: 73
Joined: 04 January 2007

Originally posted by: apackwood

So, 9 months or so after I started work at my first job in electronic design I get to wondering, at what point do young engineers stop being considered as the 'graduate'.



Understand I'm not unhappy with being labelled as a graduate, the company I'm with are offereing excellant support and have allways got people to help me out when I'm stuck (which is often).



Graduate scheme's I assume transition you at the end of them into a full proffesional, but as the only raw graduate in the company there is no 'this is what you have to do to become an engineer', I work on similar jobs to all the other engineers, admittedly simpler ones at the moment.



So the question I suppose is, how long does the transition from graduate to engineer take? Is it something you push through yourself, or is it something achieved via recognition from above?


It varies a lot but most of our graduates are on that grade for about 4 years.
 03 June 2013 01:28 PM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message



planetz31

Posts: 8
Joined: 25 July 2008

My personal experience is as follows.

I started on a graduate job on a structured 4 year development programme just over 3 years ago. At no point did my job title have graduate in it but I was "Engineer". After 2 years I started leading work packages and took on responsibility for research contracts. I had to fight for improvement in my work grade.

Upon getting it I was at a level where my collegues are given the title Senior Engineer, I was left as just Engineer and fobbed off with some statement saying we cant progress a graduate beyond other staff. This then took some arguing by myself and others to senior staff about how I had taken on more and shown more capability than others and was deserving of the job title. They have shortened the scheme now that I am on it and I will be completing it next month. If I do not get the recognition of Senior Engineer I will be looking elsewhere.

I am of the opinion that if you show competance its not down to a timescale which fits everyone. After 32 months of working I have submitted my CEng application and I want to be recognised for it. If you are out-performing "non-graduates" then I think it is only fair to ask for the advancement.

Just my two cents.

Amar
 04 June 2013 09:35 AM
User is offline View Users Profile Print this message



amillar

Posts: 1918
Joined: 28 May 2002

I would be somewhat (!) surprised if you achieved the title Senior Engineer three years after graduation. Now, as I said above, there are absolutely no rules about job titles so it is up to the company what they call you. But as a very rough rule of thumb a good career progression might be:
2 years as graduate engineer
5-10 years as engineer
10 years as senior engineer
xx years as principal engineer (or similar), or - if you've been really bad in a previous life - move into management!

I would strongly suggest looking at job adverts from other companies and seeing what level of expertise and experience they expect from engineers at different levels, and talk to other engineers e.g. other IET members. Be careful that you don't get distracted by the idea that leading projects gives you a level of seniority - leading projects takes energy, having technical authority takes experience. (Actually, leading projects excellently also takes experience, but many engineering project managers make up for this with huge enthusiasm and energy - but after a few years they normally start to wonder why they're working every evening and weekend!)

-------------------------
Andy Millar CEng MIET CMgr MCMI

http://www.linkedin.com/in/millarandy

"The aim of argument, or of discussion, should not be victory, but progress." Joseph Joubert
Statistics

See Also:



FuseTalk Standard Edition v3.2 - © 1999-2014 FuseTalk Inc. All rights reserved.