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Topic Title: Goodbye IET
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Created On: 31 March 2011 02:05 PM
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 12 September 2011 09:45 AM
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Togora

Posts: 5
Joined: 24 November 2006

I have just received my membership subscription renewal notice which surprise, surprise is another increase! Is the IET blinkered to the financial problems people are suffering at the moment? Perhaps the IET Board should take the Government's advice and tighten their belts.

Will I be renewing my subscription? I really don't know. I will have to give this very serious consideration and to be totally honest I have never needed my membership of the IET to get me a job. So the question is, is being a member of the IET really THAT important? Is this an outmoded form of community for professionals?
 12 September 2011 04:18 PM
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Jim Harden

Posts: 69
Joined: 25 July 2008

Could not agree with you more Graham. The IET is an out of date "old boys club" for our University" friends". Perhaps it should change its name to the "Institute of Engineering Tutors" otherwise known as the "University Old Boys Society".

After a number years I doubt I will renew my membership

Jim Harden
 14 September 2011 05:33 PM
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MikeWrigley

Posts: 100
Joined: 16 April 2002

Yes, they will phone you eventually, SAVIO. But only next March and all they will be interested in is your cheque. Nobody in that department can do anything about the way the Institution and its services are run and they probably don't have a clue about most of it anyway. See my previous post above.

-------------------------
Mike Wrigley
Past Chairman, French Network
 17 September 2011 08:28 AM
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SAVIO

Posts: 343
Joined: 07 May 2002

How much did the membership subscription increase in this year?

In 2006, IEE promised the future membership subscription will not be increased substantially even the formation of the new IET, therefore, I vote for yes for the IET formation.

But, over the years from 2006, the IET membership subscriptions have increased substantially.

What the IEE promised in 2006 had broke! I have made the wrong vote for the IET formation, it is better off to keep the IEE for me as an electrical engineer. At least, they don't have any excuse for IEE membership subcription increase substantially over the years!

IET being the largest engineering institution in the world in terms of number of members. Why the IET membership subscription cannot be lower in considering the economic of scale?

 19 September 2011 01:05 PM
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kasese

Posts: 183
Joined: 31 March 2006

My subscription is due for renewal 01/10/11 and I am tempted not to renew - goes back to a statement made by CEng interview panel about 4 years ago - "would it make any diffence to be CEng at this late stage in your career". I started to think - "does being a member / IEng have any benefits" - very little! I could spend the £178 elsewhere.
2 colleagues have already dropped out (Ex Prod Eng).

Tim Guy
 30 September 2011 09:15 PM
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kasese

Posts: 183
Joined: 31 March 2006

Last posting today - membership expires tonight.
They have really devalued CEng in my case -
I don't know any CEng's that should have the level according the my last PRI panel

Tim Guy
MSc MBA GCGI HND(Engineering) DEM(Hons)
Plant Engineer / Engineering Manager
 01 December 2011 07:20 PM
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roddalitz

Posts: 125
Joined: 19 April 2002

I have had enough of the IET. I have evidence that when I joined, those who had paid 25 years of membership would thereafter be free. Gradually, this eroded, first to 25%, then 50%, recently FULL fees - and when you are retired, the Inland Revenue no longer give any tax allowance.

When I was employed, my employers paid the fees - first Oertling, then Scottish and Newcastle Breweries, then Ferranti, GEC, and BAE. Now I am retired and I have to pay my own fees; for a few years I organised part-time work and I could claim tax relief, but now I pay the whole sum. In return I appear to get very little; the whole amount paid to IET Scotland for administration and local events is well under £2 per head, and the IET magazine (while it is greatly improved over 20 years ago) contains little more than many free engineering journals. Even the Wiring Regulations - which I bought several years ago to keep up to date - were available from an internet store with a discount over the IET price to its own members!

I requested some data on IET members joining and leaving, and I concluded the average time a member remains is two to three years, with a very long tail out to 20 or 30 years. So, since I have been an Associate since 1976 and a Member and CEng since around 1982, I have been subsidising the IET for far too long. If the original rules of 25 years paying and then free remained, the IET would actually suffer little loss from the minority of loyal members.

I have interviewed many candidates for CEng over the past five years, and found it fascinating to understand the rich variety of careers and personal styles of the candidates. Also there have been some challenges in understanding and interpreting the guidelines - I still have an axe to grind regarding the difference in status between IEng and CEng, which I believe should be "equal but different."

I have had a great deal of enjoyment and education from serving on the EC&I committee. I have had a lot of practice at running meetings; I have managed the Monitor audio magazine since 1996, with 55 interviews published; I have organised not only lectures but two evening seminars, with three speakers at each, which is a lot more public speaking than I ever had to do at work. All good stuff, and I have been paid travel expenses to attend, but then I have to pay my membership fee to continue.

Frankly I have plenty of other things to do with my money and with my life, which have taken a back seat.

I have transferred my CEng to the Institute of Physics, where I have been a member since 1974. IoP is not only cheaper and offers a wider range of lectures, but offered me Fellowship while the IET refused my application.

So there you are: so long, and then, so long.

-------------------------
regards, Rod Dalitz (CEng MIEE FInstP)
rod.dalitz@blueyonder.co.uk
 01 December 2011 09:12 PM
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Jim Harden

Posts: 69
Joined: 25 July 2008

Rod,

I am sure the Leadership will be dis-appointed that you are leaving - who else is going to subsidise the lavish lifestyle of IET and do all the "donkey work".

The reason you were denied Fellowship is easy to us mere mortals (the great unwashed) - you are from a "real engineering" background and not academia. If you were a Lecturer or better still a Senior Lecturer/Professor they would be falling over you to offer you Fellowship.

Like you I have become tired of the way IET is going and after 10 years I am calling it a day - I too will not be renewing my membership.

As a member of the Scottish Region (for 4 more weeks) can I thank you for your efforts and wish you well in your retirement

Jim Harden
 06 December 2011 02:26 PM
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GHall

Posts: 2
Joined: 06 December 2011

Originally posted by: Jim Harden


Like you I have become tired of the way IET is going and after 10 years I am calling it a day - I too will not be renewing my membership.




Jim Harden


As I have said in a previous post if you feel that way Jim then maybe it is best for all that you just leave because it is obvious that The IET is not right for you. All you want to do is cause grievance against The IET. Yes they have their faults but so do other organisations. I am not saying they are perfect, far from that, but its all about what you put in not about how much you can gain at little expense. We are all professional here and sometimes I read your comments and think I am in a kindergarden playground!!
 06 December 2011 03:16 PM
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mbirdi

Posts: 1907
Joined: 13 June 2005

Originally posted by: roddalitz
I have transferred my CEng to the Institute of Physics, where I have been a member since 1974. IoP is not only cheaper and offers a wider range of lectures, but offered me Fellowship while the IET refused my application.

I agree with you. I was going to apply for MInstP, but decided instead to apply for IOPimember with access to all online journals and free events for £15 pa. Cheap as chips.

I'm probably going to cancel my membership with the IET in the next few days as I no longer feel the need to pay £129 pa with increasing fees every year. That will bring closure to 26 years of continous membership.

But time moves on and so must I.

Edited: 06 December 2011 at 04:29 PM by mbirdi
 13 December 2011 12:18 PM
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jcm256

Posts: 1841
Joined: 01 April 2006

mbirdi,
Hope you are not really leaving. Your writings were always worth reading, and brought a balance to the forum. Well you nearly did it, the name change for Incorporated Engineer and thank you for championing that cause, at least you made the Engineering Council sit up and take notice.
Regards
John Moore I Eng MIET
 13 December 2011 03:21 PM
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rar

Posts: 642
Joined: 30 August 2005

What the new name for Incorporated Engineer?
 13 December 2011 04:49 PM
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mbirdi

Posts: 1907
Joined: 13 June 2005

John,

Thank you for those kind words. It's much appreciated.

I am in the process of cancelling my membership. However, I hope to stay in touch with the forums for some months at least before reducing participation to a few visits a year.

Unfortunately, I don't see the IET is moving forward anywhere. There is lack of technical substance for members to get their teeth into, to justify paying the equivalent of a TV licence for. And look what we get for our licence fees in comparison? A hell of a lot of programs and entertainment (albeit with some repeats).

The IET website is littered with information about what the rest of the world is doing in Science, Engineering and Technology, but not what the IET is doing as a lead organisation. This is a sign of failure in the IET's executives.

Membership is no longer worth anything anymore. I don't recall ever using my membership grade to gain a job or promotion. I certainly don't use it in my daily working life. So what is it for if not to pay for the maintenance of the IET buildings, staff salaries and pensions, not forgetting the comfortable environment of the building in the form of heating and lighting and furnishings.

I've come to the conclusion that it's far better for me to use the subscription fees to pay for my needs than for the IET's needs.

Cheers,
 13 December 2011 05:29 PM
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Jim Harden

Posts: 69
Joined: 25 July 2008

How many more will it take before the Leadership realise that there is a real concern amongst the "grass root" membership.

What is needed is a clear statement for those in charge as to what direction the IET is taking. We do not know where we are going or how we intend to get there.

The personal attack on me made by GHall is not helpful , but I an "grown up" enough to ignore it.

For the record I want to see the IET regain the position held by both the IEE & IIE as the premier Engineering Institute not just the largest. In todays world size does not matter.

Jim
 13 December 2011 06:20 PM
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jcm256

Posts: 1841
Joined: 01 April 2006

RAR, this was in 2008, when most of I Engs was with IIE, mbirdi was at the forefront of these proposels..

The ECuk consultation on the future title for Incorporated Engineers is progressing.
The ECuk IEng working party has drawn up the following shortlist of titles for
consideration by the institutions, including the option to stay with IEng:

Engineer Practitioner (EngP)
Incorporated Engineer (IEng)
Registered Engineer (REng)
Chartered Certified Engineer (CCE)
Associate Chartered Engineer (ACE)

This may be our last chance to get the title right and encourage a great number of qualified
Engineers to register.
I will be voting for Chartered Certified Engineer(CCE)If asked to vote.
What do other Incorporated Engineers think?
as regards to this topic

John Moore
08/05/08 18:35:32
(Extract taken from SOE website which at the time I was also a MSOE MBES)

Note: (The Engineering Council opted to stay with I Eng.)
 15 December 2011 11:00 AM
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mbirdi

Posts: 1907
Joined: 13 June 2005

This is precisely the way the IET and EC shouldn't be running the profession. If they purport to believe in IEngs (and other catagories) as competent professional engineers, then they should be consulting them before planning any marketing strategy.

Unfortunately, the majority of members (BSc lot) tend to huddle together like meerkats, desperate in hanging on to their coveted graduate and CEng status and therefore believe they are the only ones fit enough to judge upon others they see as inferior.

Edited: 15 December 2011 at 03:49 PM by mbirdi
 15 December 2011 11:36 AM
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westonpa

Posts: 1771
Joined: 10 October 2007

Originally posted by: mbirdi

Unfortunately, the majority of members (BSc lot) tend to huddle together like meerkats, desperate in hanging on to their coveted graduate and CEng status and therefore believe they are the only ones fit enough to judge upon others they see as inferior.


If we review recent discussions on awarding of CEng to those without exemplifying qualifications then it is somewhat difficult to know if the 'BSc lot' are the ones doing the judging or otherwise who they 'see as inferior'. Evidence would suggest that the IET/EC are more concerned about the competencies rather than the actual qualifications, BSc, HNC, MEng or otherwise, and are thus open to all who meet the competency requirements.

Regards.
 15 December 2011 12:27 PM
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Jim Harden

Posts: 69
Joined: 25 July 2008

Westonpa,

I beg to differ. As previously posted I contacted "Membership" for guidance on gaining IEng. They immediately informed me that I did not have the necessary academic qualifications therefore I could not achieve IEng (despite more than 30 years experience). Looks like IET will look at alternatives for CEng but not other grades.

By its own admission IET has no interest in IEng, they took not part in the EC campaign to boost the status of IEng membership.

Engineering is a "broad church" covering a multitude of specialities and skill levels not just the academically qualified elite. All have a key part to play.

Jim
 15 December 2011 01:12 PM
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westonpa

Posts: 1771
Joined: 10 October 2007

Maybe your experience was not sufficient to meet the competency requirements without the exemplifying qualifications and hence their comments. However my reply was to mbirdi's comments about the 'BSc lot' etc., and the relevant CEng discussions. He will understand what I am referring to and that my comments were not without some subtle humour.

I'm not going to defend the EC/IET on their IEng or CEng assessment processes after having made a lengthy argument in which I highlighted where I thought there were significant weaknesses. By default however the IET is concerned about IEng and does offer a route to it which does not include exemplifying qualifications.....whether it is concerned enough or that route is as it should be is another matter.

Regards.
 15 December 2011 03:26 PM
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mbirdi

Posts: 1907
Joined: 13 June 2005

westonpa,

I was referring to the old school BSc lot. (1960s - 80s). There are plenty of examples from past IEE member's letters online including some recent comments from members representing the face of IET, that subtly hint at snobbishness.

To give you sample. Over 5 years ago I attended an IET CEng registration event, where members can discuss with IET staff about suitability for registration. I brought with me about 40 pages of my job description, which was used to justify my upgraded pay rise with my organisation. A young representative from the IET spoke with me of my situation. After explaining what I had been doing over the years, he suggested I was the perfect candidate to apply for CEng. When I eventually met with a mature representative and briefly discussed my career over the years, including academic achievement and mentioned I brought with me a job description portfolio. Like a school master, he immediately responded with the view that I would be suitable for IEng registration, without even looking at the details of my job description.

That is the difference between the old school BSc (headmaster mentality) and the newer school graduate. I saw another example on these forums from the IET head of membership to a college educated CEng who asked if his qualification (CEI Part 2) could be recognised by the IET as degree level, so that employers could match his CV with explanation on the IET website. The response to the query was an example of blatant snobbery.

Edited: 15 December 2011 at 04:04 PM by mbirdi
IET » Feedback and questions » Goodbye IET

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