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Topic Title: Which Certificate?
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Created On: 08 December 2013 05:59 PM
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 08 December 2013 05:59 PM
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AncientMariner

Posts: 579
Joined: 14 December 2004

A couple of months back had some electrical work (extending an existing lighting circuit into conservatory, fitting a switched fused spur in same conservatory to power roof window openers and additional socket - both of existing spur) carried out by NICEIC registered electrician.

Which Certificate should he supply me with once I've paid his invoice?
(I guess he should technically supply the Certificate in any event, but can understand retention).

Thanks.

Cheers!

Clive

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Clive S Carver GCGI IEng MIET
 08 December 2013 06:13 PM
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prophet

Posts: 283
Joined: 09 October 2011

Minor Electrical Installation Works Certificate ............which of course was left on site once the work was energised ;-)

He shouldn't be holding test certificates back on the condition you pay him.

Tom
 08 December 2013 06:37 PM
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daveparry1

Posts: 6826
Joined: 04 July 2007

Agreed, Minor Works Cert.

Dave.
 08 December 2013 06:40 PM
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AncientMariner

Posts: 579
Joined: 14 December 2004

Many thanks Tom & Dave, I will remind them to supply the Minor Works Cert when I send the cheque.

Cheers!

Clive

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Clive S Carver GCGI IEng MIET
 08 December 2013 10:30 PM
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maltrefor

Posts: 124
Joined: 01 November 2009

A Minor Electrical Installation Works Certificate for EACH of the circuits which were altered !!!
 09 December 2013 11:01 AM
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AJJewsbury

Posts: 12617
Joined: 13 August 2003

A Minor Electrical Installation Works Certificate for EACH of the circuits which were altered !!!

Agreed - or the electrician could legitimately choose to issue a single EIC for all the changes.

(pedantically speaking it should be an EIC anyway as the fused spur creates a new circuit).

- Andy.
 12 July 2015 07:47 PM
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AncientMariner

Posts: 579
Joined: 14 December 2004

Am still waiting for the Certificate(s) despite some polite reminders. The girl in their office says she is aware of them but so far nothing.

When I contact again this week, I am expecting to be told that they no longer have the test results...

So, two questions:-

Assuming the Certificate(s) were made out and not sent to me, would there be a duplicate/carbon copy kept in say a duplicate book?

Is there an obligation on a NICEIC registered electrician to keep records of test results.

Would NICEIC be able to help?

Edited to add that I have just used the NICEIC website http://www.checkmynotification.com/
and according to my postcode (CH5 3HS) there has not been a notification made !!!

Great...

Cheers!

-------------------------
Clive S Carver GCGI IEng MIET

Edited: 12 July 2015 at 07:54 PM by AncientMariner
 12 July 2015 08:04 PM
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daveparry1

Posts: 6826
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The job would not have been notifiable as it's not a new circuit and is not in a "special location". (a room containing a bath or shower)
 12 July 2015 08:17 PM
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AncientMariner

Posts: 579
Joined: 14 December 2004

OK.

So how do I get the Minor Works Cert?

If the work was not notifiable, could I have done that work myself without involving the local Council's Building Control?

Thanks.

Cheers!

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Clive S Carver GCGI IEng MIET
 12 July 2015 08:56 PM
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daveparry1

Posts: 6826
Joined: 04 July 2007

As long as you are competent (and i'm sure you are Clive) and have complied with regulations and done the necessary testing you can write out your own MWC. You can download the cert. from this site as i'm sure you already know. It isn't necessary to be a member of a scheme to issue certificates.
As this job is not notifiable BC don't need to be involved at all.
 12 July 2015 09:29 PM
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mapj1

Posts: 4790
Joined: 22 July 2004

You could indeed have done it yourself, without notifying anyone at all, being non-notifiable work, and also, if you wished, you could have signed your own certificates, assuming you know how to use a meter

-------------------------
regards Mike
 12 July 2015 09:39 PM
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leckie

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Well in my opinion Clive has employed an NICEIC contractor and they should be supplying the MWC. Why on earth should he do it himself? I think you should write to the contractor and say you require the MWC by return of post. Tell them if they are not prepared to issue the MWC could they instead send you an NICEIC Complaints Form. You can then use this form to issue a formal complaint to the NICEIC. If they do not or are not prepared to send you a complaints form, you can request one from the NICEIC. This is the correct NICEIC procedure.

The work is not actually considered complete without certification, so really you should not have paid them until the MWC had been issued to you, but regardless of that, you should still be getting the certificates required.
 12 July 2015 09:47 PM
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AncientMariner

Posts: 579
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Thanks for that info Dave.

I didn't know that the IET had model forms. I do now and just downloaded and saved for the next time.

Cheers!

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Clive S Carver GCGI IEng MIET
 12 July 2015 09:51 PM
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kshrimpton

Posts: 17
Joined: 15 February 2007

Re the duplicates comment Clive. If the original was completed on NICEIC certificate, there is a carbon copy for the originator which should be kept for at least 3 years as stated on the certificate notes.

KS
 12 July 2015 10:01 PM
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daveparry1

Posts: 6826
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I agree with all you said Leckie but I suppose that as this has been going on for about 18 months now it's hardly worth the bother of going through the NIEIC route, after all it is only a MWC. I think it would be a different matter if it were an EIC and/or notifiable etc.
 13 July 2015 08:18 AM
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mapj1

Posts: 4790
Joined: 22 July 2004

Well even if it was illegal, and not just poor practice not to keep the paperwork, there is a statute of limitations - I imagine its non-inditable, and the magistrates court act part 127 will apply. (unless its a failure of the environmental aspects, in which case its longer..)

In reality if the guy had the results he would have sent them by now; so either it was tested and the page blew out of the van window at the traffic lights on the way home (well that will be the story) or (just maybe) it was never fully tested.

So either you are going to have to make it so uncomfortable that it becomes best for him to come back and re-measure, (and be marked up as a "never again" customer) or accept that its probably OK really.

Even if you suddenly got a form with some plausible looking numbers on, at this stage, with no further visit, would you really believe them to be from your job? or just suspect an 'estimated meter reading'...
You do see surprisingly similar numbers sometimes - maybe that chap's meter always reads a third of an ohm and >199M regardless of what he connects it to..

-------------------------
regards Mike
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