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Topic Title: Burger van
Topic Summary: earthing etc
Created On: 11 May 2013 05:29 AM
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 11 May 2013 05:29 AM
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MPVaughan

Posts: 104
Joined: 07 August 2010

Hi fellas,

Ive been asked to wire up a burger van.... Usual stuff, power points, lights etc.
The guy will use a portable genny to power the van.

My Q is,

Earthing / bonding - with regards to the van chassis / metalwork connected to the battery Negative terminal, if the genny was running at the same time as the vans engine would this cause any foreseeable problems?
 11 May 2013 09:24 PM
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slittle

Posts: 3374
Joined: 22 November 2007

I'd be more concerned with the fact it's sitting on four rubber tyres and the genny probably won't have an electrode ;-)


Stu
 11 May 2013 10:31 PM
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jcm256

Posts: 1793
Joined: 01 April 2006

Seen actually two burger vans yesterday in car park, off the shelf generator battering away, what was annoying was the blue socket connected the wrong way around , the angled socket attached to the van and the plug top on the extension lead from the generator. Not going to give advice as don't know if you are floating or earthing/neutral one leg of the small generator. What I do know is sometimes local councils ask for an electrical certificate and portable appliance test as well

Only advice can give is see:
(See BS 7671:2008+A1:2011,
Section 717, see also 3.33, Note 2, and IET Guidance Note 7 [6].)


Also:
(PDF]
2011 39 Summer Wiring Matters - IET Electrical
electrical.theiet.org/wiring-matters/39/portable-generators.cfm




Germany regulations they use an insulation-monitoring device called A-Isometer which can be used with unearthed mobile generator supplies.


http://www.bender-ca.com/filea...enerators_PROSP_en.pdf


Only quoted German site for the simplicity of something you can see, the equivalent BS7671 on insulation monitoring devices, for an unfamiliar subject is grossly inadequate.
Figure 717.7 page 251. (Refer also to section 551)

Edited: 12 May 2013 at 08:55 AM by jcm256
 12 May 2013 06:40 AM
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normcall

Posts: 8063
Joined: 15 January 2005

I watched a van using a generator the other day who got out a prepared earthing rod, carefully placed it on the road and drove forward and 'parked on it.
Better than drilling a hole in the public highway, I suppose. didn't wait to see if a bucket of water was used or if a dog did his 'duty'!

-------------------------
Norman
 12 May 2013 01:11 PM
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slittle

Posts: 3374
Joined: 22 November 2007

Norm,

We used to do exactly that with incident vehicles in my old job.

Big square plate of metal with a couple of nice lifting handles on it, crews were instructed to park on it and then connect the flying lead to it.

Not really sure how effective it was because once the vehicle was set up it also had levelling jacks and steps pushing down onto the ground, but at least it gave the feeling of trying.

Stu
 12 May 2013 01:46 PM
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OMS

Posts: 18919
Joined: 23 March 2004

Originally posted by: slittle

Norm,

We used to do exactly that with incident vehicles in my old job.

Big square plate of metal with a couple of nice lifting handles on it, crews were instructed to park on it and then connect the flying lead to it.

Not really sure how effective it was because once the vehicle was set up it also had levelling jacks and steps pushing down onto the ground, but at least it gave the feeling of trying.

Stu


FRS Emergency control vehicles, Stu ?

We had a hell of a job trying to get a change through - based on the fact that it was a completely pointless exercise.

I was involved with a few of the tri-service arrangements when things like Gold and Silver commanders went into use - trying to reconcile what police, fire and ambulance did wasn't easy - as they all did different things, had different SOP's and no one was prepared to change.

regards

OMS

-------------------------
Failure is always an option
 12 May 2013 02:38 PM
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slittle

Posts: 3374
Joined: 22 November 2007

Yep :-)

The previous vehicle had a normal 3/8 rod and a bit of 6mm to it. Try driving that through tesco's car park


Stu
 12 May 2013 03:00 PM
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rocknroll

Posts: 8808
Joined: 03 October 2005

In our four transportable labs which only go out occasionally if there is a possibility of something really really bad imminent, inside the side double doors in a compartment is a 450 x 450 x 4mm copper plate to go under the wheel or jack.

A few years ago now at a regular spot with a Norwegian radio station on a week long outdoor event the earth was a coil of copper cable thrown on the floor with a couple of sub flight cases on the top.

You worry too much.

regards

-------------------------
"Take nothing but a picture,
leave nothing but footprints!"
-------------------------
"Oh! The drama of it all."
-------------------------
"You can throw all the philosophy you like at the problem, but at the end of the day it's just basic electrical theory!"
-------------------------

Edited: 12 May 2013 at 03:22 PM by rocknroll
 12 May 2013 03:23 PM
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sparkingchip

Posts: 5695
Joined: 18 January 2003

Locally a BBC guy died when he parked up a estate car with a self elevating telescopic aerial under some HV cables, looking up is probably more important than looking down.
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