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Topic Title: HA Spec
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Created On: 24 July 2012 09:21 AM
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 24 July 2012 09:21 AM
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Avatar for ebee.
ebee

Posts: 5620
Joined: 02 December 2004

How long ago did we stop using the term ELCB (and in fact stopped using ELCB - even current operated ones) in favour of RCDs?

Got a spec for "Split Load" with no ELCB to lighting for a CU change.

and other anomalies !

-------------------------
Regards,
Ebee (M I S P N)

Knotted cables cause Lumpy Lektrik
 24 July 2012 09:40 AM
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OMS

Posts: 18919
Joined: 23 March 2004

LoL - Sounds like they've been recycling that spec for quite a while Ebee

I don't have all my old regs books available at the moment - I'd hazard a guess that it was pre 16th Edition ?

One for BOD and his extensive library I suspect

Regards

OMS

-------------------------
Failure is always an option
 24 July 2012 10:11 AM
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Avatar for ebee.
ebee

Posts: 5620
Joined: 02 December 2004

LOL.
What they actually said was as follows
(The names have been changed to protect the guilty):-

Fred Bloggs - Housing Association Officer



Electrical Works

All electrical works should comply with the latest Part P (Electrical
Safety) Building Regulations, British Standard requirements for electrical installations and the current IEE Regulations published by the Institution of Electrical Engineers.

The works are to be carried out by a 'Competent Electrician' registered
with a Government Approved Competent Person Scheme and able to
supply an Electrical lnstallation Certificate on completion. This must be
forwarded to The Housing Association with the final
invoice.

Should the Electrician not be registered, they must submit a Building
Notice to the Local Authority Building Control Dept, with the appropriate
fee and provide evidence to (Another Housing Association that this doc has been copied from I think) that this has been done before
commencing the work. The Local Authority will issue a completion
Notice and Electrical lnstallation Certificate on completion. This must
be forwarded to The Housing Association with the final
invoice.

New consumer unit

lnstall a new consumer unit of the split load circuit breaker type
incorporating a main isolator switch and 30 m.a. earth leakage cirtuit
breaker protecting sockets, cooker and immersion heater circuits.
Lighting circuits must not be connected via the E.L.C.B.
Each circuit must be protected by its own circuit breaker of appropriate
size.

-------------------------
Regards,
Ebee (M I S P N)

Knotted cables cause Lumpy Lektrik
 24 July 2012 10:21 AM
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Avatar for OMS.
OMS

Posts: 18919
Joined: 23 March 2004

Well that one's a bit dated for sure - If you know the individuals involved at all, offer to update it for them - at a cost of course.

Most certainly, I would qualify my offer to clarify that you will comply with " British Standard requirements for electrical installations and the current IEE Regulations published by the Institution of Electrical Engineers " and " the latest Part P (Electrical Safety) Building Regulations "

just reiterate that you will be connecting lighting circuits via an "ELCB" - you know the drill -

Regards (and good luck with the bid)

OMS

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Failure is always an option
 24 July 2012 10:32 AM
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AJJewsbury

Posts: 10964
Joined: 13 August 2003

What's the wiring system? Just a though that if it's surface, in steel conduit or pyro (unlikley but not impossible in some HA sites), there's probably no requirement for 30mA RCD protection for the lighting.
- Andy.
 24 July 2012 10:36 AM
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Avatar for OMS.
OMS

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other than the bit that serves the bathroom, Andy ?

regards

OMS

-------------------------
Failure is always an option
 24 July 2012 11:10 AM
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AJJewsbury

Posts: 10964
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other than the bit that serves the bathroom, Andy ?

They have internal bathroom now do they? Must be down south....
- Andy.
 24 July 2012 11:34 AM
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Avatar for OMS.
OMS

Posts: 18919
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Originally posted by: AJJewsbury

other than the bit that serves the bathroom, Andy ?


They have internal bathroom now do they? Must be down south....

- Andy.


So I'm told, Andy - I believe the Ty Bach is currently out of favour in the great Metropolis -

Regards

OMS

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Failure is always an option
 24 July 2012 11:40 AM
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Boyobach

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Ty Bach - still in use in the valleys!
 24 July 2012 11:56 AM
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Avatar for OMS.
OMS

Posts: 18919
Joined: 23 March 2004

Yes, I believe Ianto "zinc roof" has a particularly fine example with a single glazed roof light, hardwood seat and a brass hook on the back of the door for the sheets of last weeks argus. He used the last of the Izal from the local NCB baths years back -

Regards

OMS

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Failure is always an option
 24 July 2012 12:05 PM
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micjamesq

Posts: 777
Joined: 23 January 2009

This practice is the same as you see in a lot of situations.

I have noticed it to be prevalent in the small private architectural field on the plans supplied for private houses.

The copy and paste but not update force is strong in this one.

Regards

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E & OE
 25 July 2012 04:06 PM
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weirdbeard

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Joined: 26 September 2011

Originally posted by: ebee

How long ago did we stop using the term ELCB (and in fact stopped using ELCB - even current operated ones) in favour of RCDs?



1981
 25 July 2012 04:14 PM
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weirdbeard

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Joined: 26 September 2011

Originally posted by: OMS


just reiterate that you will be connecting lighting circuits via an "ELCB" - you know the drill -



Typo? did you mean vill, as in 've vill make you fit ze rcd'?

If it's just a board change requested and the bathroom is supplementary bonded and no work is being carried out in the bathroom there is no requirement for the installer to install rcd protection to lighting circuits.
 25 July 2012 04:28 PM
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Avatar for OMS.
OMS

Posts: 18919
Joined: 23 March 2004

Indeed, but the EIC for the new DB will, under comments on existing electrical installation, point out the lack of RCD protection on circuits of a special location and for cables (assumed) concelaed within the building fabric less than 50mm deep in an installation intended for unskilled or unsupervised persons won't it ?

At which point the HA technical authority will go mental and ask why you haven't complied with BS 7671, part P and any other regulation known to man - he just won't understand the nuance of it all.

regards

OMS

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Failure is always an option
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