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Topic Title: Guarantee of Standards Scheme
Topic Summary: Do all schemes have one?
Created On: 30 March 2009 07:39 PM
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 30 March 2009 07:39 PM
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perspicacious

Posts: 7244
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This is from the NICEIC www:

Independent Complaints Procedure
NICEIC operates an independent complaints procedure governing the technical standards of electrical installation of its Approved Contractor and Domestic Installer Schemes. If the electrical work of a registered contractor is found to be below the accepted technical standard, NICEIC requires the contractor to correct the work, at no additional cost to the customer. NICEIC is concerned solely with the safety and technical standard of the electrical work carried out by Approved Contractors, and the standard of certification and periodic inspection reports which Approved Contractors are responsible for producing.

Guarantee of Standards Scheme
NICEIC expects its registered contractors to provide a quality service to their customers and, therefore, endeavour to resolve all complaints about the technical standard of their electrical work. If a customer and an Approved Contractor are unable to resolve an alleged deficiency in the technical standard of electrical work, the customer can make a formal complaint to NICEIC.

As described above, the NICEIC Complaints Procedure requires the an NICEIC-registered contractor to resolve the technical deficiency without additional cost to the consumer. However, if the contractor does not undertake the required remedial work, NICEIC's Guarantee of Standards Scheme ensures it will be done by another NICEIC-registered contractor, at no cost to the customer.


Initial reading of other schemes appears to require the consumer to have bought the optional Warranty to be able to get their scheme to take action against a member, whereas the NICEIC will fulfill the role of consumer protection without this by having a Guarantee of Standards not dependant on a warranty being purchased by the consumer.

I ask as a client is about to use my report to complain about the standard of work carried out by a scheme member (not an NICEIC-registered contractor) and apart from the poor standard of work and lack of EIC, no notification was made and the Approved Contractor did not provide the client with the opportunity to purchase warranty insurance on his work.

Hopefully I have missed this in other schemes Rules and if not, it would appear that there is no mechanism (other than via Trading Standards) to get "guilty parties" back to correct their work. Can anyone belonging to a non NICEIC scheme post their scheme link that ensures that the technical deficiency is resolved without additional cost to the consumer?

Regards

BOD
 30 March 2009 07:49 PM
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kevfwil

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I'm not a member yet but is this what you want?

http://www.napit.org.uk/consumerComplaints.asp

Regards,

Kev
 30 March 2009 07:56 PM
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Martynduerden

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Interesting the NAPIT "work guarantee scheme"

"this cover is only for work that has been agreed in writing prior to any work commencing and may only be compliant following the issue of a work completion certificate"

I bet there are not many domestic jobs where all the work is agreed prior.

-------------------------
Regards

Martyn.

Only a mediocre person is always at their best



www.electrical contractors uk.com

Edited: 30 March 2009 at 07:57 PM by Martynduerden
 30 March 2009 08:00 PM
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perspicacious

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"Please note that in some cases, NAPIT can only progress with investigations that are supported by a contract of work agreed by the complainant and the other party."

And echoing Martyn's extract:

"I bet there are not many domestic jobs where all the work is agreed prior."

Any Elecsa Rules anyone?

Regards

BOD
 30 March 2009 08:02 PM
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Martynduerden

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Am I going to end up being a NIC supporter here BOD ?

-------------------------
Regards

Martyn.

Only a mediocre person is always at their best



www.electrical contractors uk.com

Edited: 30 March 2009 at 08:02 PM by Martynduerden
 30 March 2009 08:10 PM
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perspicacious

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"Am I going to end up being a NIC supporter here BOD ?"

It looks so far as if they are the only ones protecting the consumer without strings attached.....

Regards

BOD
 30 March 2009 08:12 PM
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perspicacious

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I wonder if this is why they are specified by the client over other schemes?....

Regards

BOD
 30 March 2009 08:23 PM
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Jaymack

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Originally posted by: Martynduerden
Am I going to end up being a NIC supporter here BOD ?

A prerequisite by NAPIT is that a contract with the customer by signature of the parties is entered into, for all work carried out.
The insurance, guarantee period of 7 years and claim form in the event of a dispute with the customer etc, all hinge on this document being in place, they provide proforma documents for repairs, small repairs etc., on their web site for downloading. I use these as it's just old commonsense.

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 30 March 2009 08:29 PM
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Martynduerden

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I wonder if this is why they are specified by the client over other schemes?....


I doubt the consumer is so aware, any references to the NIC is usually because they know no different.

-------------------------
Regards

Martyn.

Only a mediocre person is always at their best



www.electrical contractors uk.com
 30 March 2009 08:34 PM
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perspicacious

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"A prerequisite by NAPIT is that a contract with the customer by signature of the parties is entered into, for all work carried out. The insurance, guarantee period of 7 years and claim form in the event of a dispute with the customer etc, all hinge on this document being in place"

This does leave the consumer without cover if the NAPIT contractor "forgets" to provide the document.

As Martyn posted "I bet there are not many domestic jobs where all the work is agreed prior."

At least the NICEIC scheme doesn't have this loophole...not that any NAPIT members would fail to issue the document would they?

Regards

BOD
 30 March 2009 08:38 PM
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perspicacious

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"I doubt the consumer is so aware"

Well judging from Zs's post about the Church and my own experience, I would say that most commercial bodies who restrict to the NICEIC, do actually know.

I wonder when NAPIT go to these organisations to push for inclusion, they point out their "document" prerequisite?

Regards

BOD
 30 March 2009 08:48 PM
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Martynduerden

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Originally posted by: perspicacious
Well judging from Zs's post about the Church and my own experience, I would say that most commercial bodies who restrict to the NICEIC, do actually know.


All my work is commercial / industrial, I cannot say I have suffered with this as yet, but I do find myself wondering "if I was registered would I have more work?"

-------------------------
Regards

Martyn.

Only a mediocre person is always at their best



www.electrical contractors uk.com
 30 March 2009 09:01 PM
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Jaymack

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Originally posted by: perspicacious
"A prerequisite by NAPIT is that a contract with the customer by signature of the parties is entered into, for all work carried out. The insurance, guarantee period of 7 years and claim form in the event of a dispute with the customer etc, all hinge on this document being in place"
This does leave the consumer without cover if the NAPIT contractor "forgets" to provide the document.

Nitpicking!

As Martyn posted "I bet there are not many domestic jobs where all the work is agreed prior."

That's an opinion, any NAPIT member who doesn't enter into a signed contract is an idiot, especially when the documents are freely available for downloading! Quotes/Estimates for the applicable work and contingency rates.

At least the NICEIC scheme doesn't have this loophole...not that any NAPIT members would fail to issue the document would they?

Presumptive guff! Try again!

Regards
 30 March 2009 09:10 PM
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perspicacious

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"Originally posted by: perspicacious
"A prerequisite by NAPIT is that a contract with the customer by signature of the parties is entered into, for all work carried out. The insurance, guarantee period of 7 years and claim form in the event of a dispute with the customer etc, all hinge on this document being in place"
This does leave the consumer without cover if the NAPIT contractor "forgets" to provide the document.

Nitpicking!"

A very simple question that has far reaching implications that has been left unanswered. I wonder why.....

"Presumptive guff! Try again!"

Well no other NAPIT reader has confirmed they issue the documents, so time will tell if you get their support here

Regards

BOD
 30 March 2009 09:11 PM
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sparkuk

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Put the hand bag away jaymack!

Edited: 30 March 2009 at 09:11 PM by sparkuk
 30 March 2009 09:23 PM
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perspicacious

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As I posted above alectricity:

"I ask as a client is about to use my report to complain about the standard of work carried out by a scheme member (not an NICEIC-registered contractor) and apart from the poor standard of work and lack of EIC, no notification was made and the Approved Contractor did not provide the client with the opportunity to purchase warranty insurance on his work."

It would appear that the client will now have to go legal.

I was sent a BBC news cutting last week headed "Death-trap" home landlord fined where a guy rented out a four storey house to students and had no fire safety measures in place. Cost him £17000 fine and £13448 in costs (plus his own). He pleaded guilty 11 days prior but by then the costs had racked up.

Regards

BOD
 30 March 2009 09:32 PM
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Jaymack

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Originally posted by: sparkuk
Put the hand bag away jaymack!

Issued free from NAPIT! want one?
http://www.napit.org.uk/

Regards
 30 March 2009 09:32 PM
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stureid

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AFAIK a NAPIT member isn't obliged to issue a contract of works; they just recommend it to protect both parties. That's the word from my first NAPIT assessment last month.

Personally I'm probably a bit too lax for my own good here; I only tend to issue contracts (and variation orders) for larger works, which has always worked for me.

To be honest though, I'm the only one who could get bitten by this because I never leave room for justifiable complaint anyway.

-------------------------
Regards
Stuart

http://www.redelectrical.co.uk
http://www.redrenewables.co.uk
 30 March 2009 09:34 PM
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Jaymack

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Originally posted by: perspicacious
A very simple question that has far reaching implications that has been left unanswered. I wonder why.....

I've had 2 requests for an NICEIC contractor in 9 months, none for a NAPIT but the requesters are now educated!

Well no other NAPIT reader has confirmed they issue the documents, so time will tell if you get their support here

You don't really expect NAPIT members to stand up and shout - me! - me!
The NAPIT assessors would detect that, they specifically request proof, there's no point as I said, in not doing it!

Try again.

Regards
 30 March 2009 09:35 PM
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sparkuk

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Originally posted by: Jaymack

Originally posted by: sparkuk

Put the hand bag away jaymack!


Issued free from NAPIT! want one?

http://www.napit.org.uk/



Regards


Not really, I have never respected NAPIT since they offered a fast track solution to five day wonder sparks just to get their membership money in!!! Of which they went back on which shows what standards they have!!!
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