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Topic Title: HV software packages
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Created On: 12 June 2007 10:27 AM
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 12 June 2007 10:27 AM
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slees

Posts: 178
Joined: 10 August 2005

I am trying to find a computer software package that can be used to do load and protection studies on HV networks, does anybody know of any good HV software, preferably an industry standard like Amtech, I have been told of one called ERACS but I'm not sure how well established it is , could anybody give me advice.
 12 June 2007 10:48 AM
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steverobo

Posts: 3
Joined: 16 April 2002

There is SKM Power Tools software which is distributed by CEE Relays in the UK.

Link removed
Link removed

The SKM software is made up of modules depending on which features you require such as:
Fault Calculations
Protection Co-ordination
Transient Stability, Motor Starting
Earth Mat Calcs
Harmonic Analysis

We have used the software for ~10 years now and it seems well suited to industrial HV systems.

I have not used Amtech but believe it originated more as an LV system tool.

The best software for you will depend on what you need it for.
We requested Demo disks from each supplier and reviewed which package suited our needs best.

Don't forget to also consider the maintenace costs to keep the software up to date.

Regards.
Steve
 12 June 2007 11:02 AM
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slees

Posts: 178
Joined: 10 August 2005

Thanks Steve, we are looking for a package that could be used by other people as well as ourselves so we need to find one that is a preffered industry standard that other people might be using. Thanks for the info.
 19 June 2007 10:51 AM
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andrewbenn

Posts: 15
Joined: 09 November 2004

I'll be honest from the start, i'm currently a uni student on a summer placement with ERA.
We developed and own ERACS - i'm currently working of filling the libary with cable data...

Its a fairly well established company, now part of the cobham group. I'm in the design consultancy section - the software isnt an industry standard as such however a demo version can be downloaded for viewing of loadflow calculations. Its a fantastic tool, and works very well - tho i must say (as a student) its fairly expensive -tho i imagin most software like this is...

if you wish i'll send you a pricing guide
 20 June 2007 12:30 PM
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stuartllewellyn

Posts: 24
Joined: 11 January 2007

I'm on a placement year in Corus, and I am using ERACS to create harmonic models of the electrical network.

Been using the software for about 6 months, takes small amount of time to get used to (as would any other software) But once you get to know the methodolgy it's a very good piece of software.

I've not used fault level or protection features just harmonic related features, but I can say I'm very impressed with the technical support from ERA. Phoned them quite a few times and are very responsive to your problems.

Often needed cable library keys, and they have found suitable data and sent to me very promptly.

Other modelling software we considered was IPSA, but ERACS had been used elsewhere on site so we decided to invest in that for my work.
 29 June 2007 10:13 AM
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stuartllewellyn

Posts: 24
Joined: 11 January 2007

andrewbenn any chance I could get some contact details for you at work, as you may be able to help me out with some cable library keys?

Much appreciated

Stuart Llewellyn
 16 July 2007 10:47 PM
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deleted_rusdyhartungi

Posts: 58
Joined: 16 July 2007

FYI, AMTECH have program to be used in MV sytem. It is called AMTECH PowerNet.

The one that is normally used for LV system for cable sizing is AMTECH ProDesign.

AMTECH PowerNet Normaly come together with ProDesign.

Rusdy Hartungi

-------------------------
Eur Ing. Dr. Rusdy Hartungi, CEng MIET, MCIBSE, MSc, MTech, MBA, BEng (Hons), IntPE(UK)
 30 August 2007 01:27 PM
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JonathanHill

Posts: 225
Joined: 09 September 2002

Others include:

SINCAL from Siemens
DigSILENT

Google for links.

Hope this helps

Jono

-------------------------
Jonno
 25 October 2007 06:31 PM
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adindas

Posts: 36
Joined: 11 July 2007

Have any one ever heard about ERACS (HV electrical design software package.
What I am interested is what is saftware could do ?
Load flow stust anayli#sys, fault level, stability study ?
 31 October 2007 11:19 PM
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kamalsiri

Posts: 37
Joined: 21 June 2002

Eracs can do all your system studies including Fault Calculations, Protection Co-ordination , Stability analysis, Motor Starting, Harmonic Analysis etc.

in addtion to ERACS and PSSE, the other widely used software is Etap, which has a much wider applications. Etap is an American software, but it has IEC 60909 calculator. Etap is much user friendly than Eracs,but all depend on your application.

Hope above is of help

Kamal Siri
 01 November 2007 06:42 PM
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adindas

Posts: 36
Joined: 11 July 2007

So what is the industry standard then for HV package sofware, which I believe should be able to do the basic things like:

-Harmonics Study
-Transient Stability Study
-Loadflow Study
-Protection Coordination Study


For analogy of what I mean with industry standrad is that: say something like using AUTOCAD for CAD work.

Edited: 02 November 2007 at 01:42 PM by adindas
 15 November 2007 12:39 PM
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steveingram

Posts: 18
Joined: 04 December 2001

Hi,

Unfortuntely I don't think there is such a thing as industry standard power system software. Different packages have different levels of compatibility between them. So they can export or import files between a few different packages.

In the UK and Ireland the network operators have tended to use either IPSA, PSSe, Digsilent or Dinis, plus a couple of others. As a result the larger power system consultants have to use some or all of these packages in order to be able to provide consultancy services to as many operators as possible. For example we have IPSA+, PSSe and PSLF.

PSSe and PSLF are intended for the larger transmission systems (area interchange analysis and capacities), whilst IPSA+ is more suited to modelling distribution and industrial systems (induction machine modelling).

IPSA+ is used by quite a few of the UK distribution network operators. This does load flow, fault level, transient stability, harmonics, protection, controller modelling (AVRs and governors). There are free demo versions on the website.

Hope this helps,

steve

-------------------------
Steve Ingram
 16 November 2007 05:49 PM
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deleted_rusdyhartungi

Posts: 58
Joined: 16 July 2007

Dear steveingram


I am aware that some HV software are company dependent so, the result could be quite bias to one product/Manufacturer such as
Dinis (Fujitsu)
PSSe (Siemens)

The following is independent of manufacturer:
IPSA
ERACS
ETAP

DO not know about PSLF

In your experience, do U think which one is the best/the most popular,
I mean in term of
-User friendly
- Have been used by many of Consultant/contractor s
- Do most of the job



Originally posted by: steveingram

Hi,



Unfortuntely I don't think there is such a thing as industry standard power system software. Different packages have different levels of compatibility between them. So they can export or import files between a few different packages.



In the UK and Ireland the network operators have tended to use either IPSA, PSSe, Digsilent or Dinis, plus a couple of others. As a result the larger power system consultants have to use some or all of these packages in order to be able to provide consultancy services to as many operators as possible. For example we have IPSA+, PSSe and PSLF.



PSSe and PSLF are intended for the larger transmission systems (area interchange analysis and capacities), whilst IPSA+ is more suited to modelling distribution and industrial systems (induction machine modelling).



IPSA+ is used by quite a few of the UK distribution network operators. This does load flow, fault level, transient stability, harmonics, protection, controller modelling (AVRs and governors). There are free demo versions on the website.



Hope this helps,



steve


-------------------------
Eur Ing. Dr. Rusdy Hartungi, CEng MIET, MCIBSE, MSc, MTech, MBA, BEng (Hons), IntPE(UK)
 16 November 2007 10:48 PM
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steveingram

Posts: 18
Joined: 04 December 2001

You're right that some packages are produced by large manufacturers, such as PSSe. This doesn't usually cause problems or conflict though. I think the main area of concern is usually the developement of transient stability models. There may also be problems when GE tries to buy a copy of PSSe from Siemens!

PSLF is very similar to PSSe but is developed by GE, used mainly in the US.

In terms of which is best/most popular etc, it really depends on your requirements. For transmission system modelling where you may be concerned about the stability of large systems then PSSe is probably the most suited package. I wouldn't say that it's very user friendly, there can be quite a big learning curve and transient stability simulations can be very complicated.

Packages like IPSA/ERACS/ETAP are more user friendly and tend to be easier to learn. All have similar capabilities. Some are more suited to industrial systems and provide cable derating calculations etc.

I know that PSSe, ETAP, DigSilent and IPSA are all used by some of the larger UK consultancies, including ours. We normally use the most suitable software for the job, unless the client specifies otherwise.

What sort of studies are you looking to perform and what type of systems and components are you modelling? The network size is less of an issue these days unless you have 10000+ busbars. More complex meshed systems may need more advanced solution techniques as well.

-------------------------
Steve Ingram
 19 November 2007 02:05 PM
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deleted_rusdyhartungi

Posts: 58
Joined: 16 July 2007

Dear Steve

Thank U for your time. I definitely do not need more than 1000 buses.

If they could do
- Load flow Study
- Harmonics Study
-Transient Stability Study
- Short circuit studies

It is definitely more than enough. Though they are using the same methods, I am aware that every software have developed their own algorithms which might result that for the same task (number of busses, etc) , some software might take longer to produce result especially if we are dealig with a lot of busess. What is your experience about this ?

Thank you

Text
What sort of studies are you looking to perform and what type of systems and components are you modelling? The network size is less of an issue these days unless you have 10000+ busbars. More complex meshed systems may need more advanced solution techniques as well.

-------------------------
Eur Ing. Dr. Rusdy Hartungi, CEng MIET, MCIBSE, MSc, MTech, MBA, BEng (Hons), IntPE(UK)
 20 November 2007 10:08 AM
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steveingram

Posts: 18
Joined: 04 December 2001

Hi Dr Rusdy,

1000 busbars should be no real problem for any decent software. PSSe for example does 60000+, IPSA+ does 4000, ERACS does up to 1500 and ETAP does 10000+.

For the analysis you require, IPSA+, ERACS and ETAP have all these capabilites, PSSe does not do the harmonic studies (I think).

Analysis time does depend on the algorithims as you say. Typically these have been developed over the past 20 to 30 years so are fairly well refined. Again 1000 busbar networks should be solved fairly quickly. Load flows will be very quick, within a second, but complex harmonic or transient studies will take longer depending on the model complexity. With a good PC transient studies on large 1000 bus networks can be done a few times slower than real time.

The different algorithims also lead to differences in the results as well, after all the algorithims are all approximatations, something that quite a few people don't realise!

If speed is an issue then IPSA+ provides a scripting facility whereby you can write a simple program to carry out a large number of similar studies automatically.

I do have a lot of experience with IPSA+ and a few other packages, if you'd like more detailed information you may wist to email me on steve.ingram@tnei.co.uk.

-------------------------
Steve Ingram
 20 November 2007 06:29 PM
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deleted_rusdyhartungi

Posts: 58
Joined: 16 July 2007

Dear Steve

Thank you for your time answering my quesion. I really apreciate that.




Originally posted by: steveingram

Hi Rusdy,



1000 busbars should be no real problem for any decent software. PSSe for example does 60000+, IPSA+ does 4000, ERACS does up to 1500 and ETAP does 10000+.



For the analysis you require, IPSA+, ERACS and ETAP have all these capabilites, PSSe does not do the harmonic studies (I think).



Analysis time does depend on the algorithims as you say. Typically these have been developed over the past 20 to 30 years so are fairly well refined. Again 1000 busbar networks should be solved fairly quickly. Load flows will be very quick, within a second, but complex harmonic or transient studies will take longer depending on the model complexity. With a good PC transient studies on large 1000 bus networks can be done a few times slower than real time.



The different algorithims also lead to differences in the results as well, after all the algorithims are all approximatations, something that quite a few people don't realise!



If speed is an issue then IPSA+ provides a scripting facility whereby you can write a simple program to carry out a large number of similar studies automatically.



I do have a lot of experience with IPSA+ and a few other packages, if you'd like more detailed information you may wist to email me on steve.ingram@tnei.co.uk.


-------------------------
Eur Ing. Dr. Rusdy Hartungi, CEng MIET, MCIBSE, MSc, MTech, MBA, BEng (Hons), IntPE(UK)
 22 November 2007 07:16 AM
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steveingram

Posts: 18
Joined: 04 December 2001

Thanks, I hope the info was useful.

-------------------------
Steve Ingram
 24 December 2007 07:36 AM
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rabitelec

Posts: 17
Joined: 02 June 2006

In my experience with ETAP, it is much user friendly and for Device Coordination it can show the protective equipments tripping events on sequence, although you could coordinate and manage the tripping on graphical overview.
 15 March 2013 09:26 AM
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Asad421

Posts: 2
Joined: 15 March 2013

I am using SINCALL 7.5 Version & i have a little problem with that after modeling result is showing with -ve Value. Anybody can share with that how i shall remove this -ve error.

Thanks
Asad
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