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Topic Title: PART M
Topic Summary: Application
Created On: 07 February 2013 01:01 PM
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 07 February 2013 01:01 PM
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John Peckham

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Part M I know does not apply to extensions and material changes to existing dwellings but the work must not make any provisions worse than they are. I know that Part M applies to new dwellings.

So if you convert a large Victorian house in to 3 dwellings is that 3 x new dwellings or is it a material change to an existing dwelling?

I ask because in seems to vary between LABC areas and the individual views of particular building inspectors.

In another circumstance converting a large warehouse in to flats creates new dwellings so Part M would apply I think but others have a different view.

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John Peckham

http://www.astutetechnicalservices.co.uk/
 07 February 2013 01:58 PM
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OMS

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Originally posted by: John Peckham

Part M I know does not apply to extensions and material changes to existing dwellings but the work must not make any provisions worse than they are. I know that Part M applies to new dwellings.

Be a bit careful, material alteration is the phrase - material change (of use) means something else.


So if you convert a large Victorian house in to 3 dwellings is that 3 x new dwellings or is it a material change to an existing dwelling?

It's a material change of use but it doesn't fall under the class in regulation 6

I ask because in seems to vary between LABC areas and the individual views of particular building inspectors.

In another circumstance converting a large warehouse in to flats creates new dwellings so Part M would apply I think but others have a different view.

Would it - ? - again, it doesn't fall into the class described in regulation 5 and regulation 6.


In all cases, we should try and make it comply, but in the cases above there is no requirement to actually do so.

Regards

OMS

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 07 February 2013 02:04 PM
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rocknroll

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Well it comes down to that word 'retrospective' again, whilst there is no requirement to change buildings that complied with a previous standard to the latest standards it should be done when it is prudent to do so, for example a major refurbishment or change of use.

So yes for major work that you describe there is generally no reason why the latest standards A-P should not be adopted for all the work that is carried out.

regards

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"Take nothing but a picture,
leave nothing but footprints!"
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"Oh! The drama of it all."
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"You can throw all the philosophy you like at the problem, but at the end of the day it's just basic electrical theory!"
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Edited: 07 February 2013 at 02:15 PM by rocknroll
 07 February 2013 02:08 PM
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John Peckham

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The AD says for material change "where the building is used as a dwelling where previously it was not". So that would seem to apply to the conversion of a warehouse in to dwellings?

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John Peckham

http://www.astutetechnicalservices.co.uk/
 07 February 2013 02:09 PM
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Parsley

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John

As OMS stated its a material change, Reg 5b states it's a material change if flats are now provided when they weren't before, 5i might be applicable as well. But it's not required as reg 6h doesn't reference reg 5b or 5i.

Regards
 07 February 2013 02:36 PM
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OMS

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Originally posted by: John Peckham

The AD says for material change "where the building is used as a dwelling where previously it was not". So that would seem to apply to the conversion of a warehouse in to dwellings?


It's a material change John, for sure, but Reg 6 doesn't require that type of material change to be considered (for Part M) - if you aren't creating an hotel, institution, public building or shop then you don't need to comply

Regards

OMS

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 09 February 2013 10:09 PM
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Martynduerden

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Originally posted by: OMS

Originally posted by: John Peckham

The AD says for material change "where the building is used as a dwelling where previously it was not". So that would seem to apply to the conversion of a warehouse in to dwellings?


It's a material change John, for sure, but Reg 6 doesn't require that type of material change to be considered (for Part M) - if you aren't creating an hotel, institution, public building or shop then you don't need to comply

Regards

OMS


Rightly or wrongly I ask my self if a person for whom Part M is intended, could reasonably access the final premises.

In essence, could a disabled person access the upper flats/level of the converted premises?

If no lifts have been designed in to the spec then I suspect that Part M has been dismissed by the main contractor and original designer.

Part M in My opinion is the tail wagging the dog, I am fortunate I realise that, However we should not be modifying stupid things like switch heights when there are far superior 21st century options that are cost effective, fairly simple to implement & do far more that make a switch or socket accessible .

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 10 February 2013 09:30 PM
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stateit

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... just as long as you don't drop/lose the goddam' remote...

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 10 February 2013 10:25 PM
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Martynduerden

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Originally posted by: stateit

... just as long as you don't drop/lose the goddam' remote...


That's what linguatronic is for

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Martyn.

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 13 February 2013 08:37 PM
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spinlondon

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Part M is not intended just for disabled people.
It is intended to provide a standard that will cover all people.
It's supposed to be used for new builds where the end user is unknown.
If for instance the end user is known, and has specific requirements, their requirements should be paramount.
 13 February 2013 10:12 PM
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Martynduerden

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Originally posted by: spinlondon

Part M is not intended just for disabled people.

It is intended to provide a standard that will cover all people.


But it doesn't it put the needs of one group of people over another and outlaws common sense.



It's supposed to be used for new builds where the end user is unknown.


Really? I thought it was for general compliance, as you know it is not limited to new builds.



If for instance the end user is known, and has specific requirements, their requirements should be paramount.


I'm not sure that is true spin, if I build a house for myself and my requirements at sockets shold be at 300 and switches at 1400, do you think I'd get a BR certificate - I think not, though I'm only guessing

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Martyn.

Only a mediocre person is always at their best



www.electrical contractors uk.com
 13 February 2013 11:29 PM
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OMS

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But it doesn't it put the needs of one group of people over another and outlaws common sense.


How so Martyn, it's just basic inclusive design - it doesn't put the needs of one group over another and it certainly doesn't outlaw common sense - what it does outlaw is the construction of buldings that deny access to all sorts of people.

When I was a kid, our local library was up about 6 or 7 steps - it was never good to see old colliers gasping half way up the steps because they couldn't simply walk through the front door - or mothers with prams/pushchairs struggling to get in. I'm sure you can think of many more examples

Regards

OMS

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Failure is always an option
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